BTW I am not saying I think morality is relative, because I certainly don't (I do believe in gay marriage, consenting adults, etc...). But you know many times in my life, I have encountered situations that made me wonder if morality isn't relative sometimes.
For example, I had this doctor once. And he was a pretty obvious racist. But he once told me, I could call him anytime, day or night, and he'd be there for me. Even if he was no longer a doctor. So was he a good person or a bad person? See what I mean?
And you know, the Star Trek theme of these boards is perfect for this. Because did you notice? The Borg. Were they evil or just different? Or what about Q?
Please post some of your own stories. I'd love to hear them...
BTW, those are a lot of memes to download. Here they are by themselves:
"The difference between generals and terrorists is only the difference between winners and losers. If you win you are called a general. If you lose…"
— Kyril Finn, The High Ground (episode), Star Trek: the Next Generation,
"One world's butcher is another world's hero. Perhaps I am neither one."
- Jarok, to Picard, TNG episodes
The Defector (episode).
"She was right. But at the wrong time."
- Kirk and Spock, Star Trek: TOS,
The City on the Edge of Forever (episode).
"Why do you resist? We only wish to raise quality of life for all species."
—LOCUTUS OF BORG, ST: TNG, The Best of Both Worlds Part II
Original Airdate: 24 Sep, 1990.
"Doctor, the sperm whale on Earth devours millions of cuttlefish as it roams the oceans. It is not evil. It is feeding."
- Picard, to Dr. Kila Marr, TNG episodes
Silicon Avatar (episode).
Anyways, I'm sorry if I've had a tendency to post a little too much here. Because you realize, I do have a lot to say. But there was just one more item that I wanted to post on this thread, about the relativity of morality.
No, I don't believe in the relativity of morality. Quite the contrary in fact. But I think it can be a motivating force in human life, to question the values that humans sometimes have and just take for granted.
Pursuant to that, I have made the following memes about quotes from Star Trek that deal with this issue. Enjoy.
But you know, another thing about hatred, as I talked about above, in relation to the relativity of morality, does it always affect action? Because I certainly have never supported hate. I've been a Democrat, and liberal to varying degrees, all my life. Ask anyone who knows me. But I like to think that sometimes people can still be good, inspite of it all, if you know what I mean.
Take that doctor above. As I said, his racism was pretty obvious. But what if he had any African American patients? Would he have treated them any differently? That's a good question. And my father and I took a tour, of the historic eastern coast of the United States in the Summer of 1998. It was a very nice trip. Trafalga tours organized it all. And at one point, we were in a tour bus. And we had this guy who ran the bus. And he was so nice, to everyone really. Then at one point, in the middle of the bus tour, I heard him talk to his buddy. It was the middle of the day, but it was a long ride. So everyone was asleep. But I heard him say, so I guess you hate Black people like I do. And his buddy responded, you know I do. But you know I was the only one who heard that. There was this middle aged Black woman in our group, and she never even heard it, like I said, I was the only one awake. And you know, he treated her so nicely. So it was ironic she didn't even know he said that.
So you should never judge a person by their beliefs, I've certainly never have. Just their actions. As MLK said "Even though it may be true that the law cannot change the heart, it can restrain the heartless." and then reinforced this idea saying "It may be true that the law cannot change the heart, but it can restrain the heartless." Or just speaking generally of the right to freedom of thought, which you know is always absolute (unlike rights regarding action), as one of my heroes, Associate Justice Justice Benjamin Cardozo (1870-1938) once said in a case "Freedom [of thought], one may say that it is the matrix, the indispensable condition, of nearly every other form of freedom.”
Simply put, I certainly do not support evil or hate-filled thoughts. Ask anyone who knows me, I never have. But I respect others' right to have them, if that's their choice, because I know I can't change them, and should never try to.
Something interesting that made me think of this thread was watching the Dolly Parton‘s Mountain Magic Christmas special that aired this week.
Most people have some idea who Dolly is. Many people claim that she’s a national treasure and even a blessing to the entire planet. Over 45+ years I’ve hardly ever heard negative remarks about Dolly.
Watching the special, she had a point to make but you really needed to see the other scenes in the episode to pick up that storyline and intentions. Unfortunately many people didn’t see this. Granted the episode was not one of my favorites, but the negativity Ive read since then has been disappointing. People who originally thought Dolly was a savior to Tennessee have now turned their backs on her by saying “Dolly’s WOKE now! She’s a disgrace to the state of TN, throw her out!!!” “Dolly doesnt have Christian morals with her disregard to our religious belief!”
I was taken back by some of the comments I read. First of all, Dolly has always been WOKE! She’s always been forthcoming about her religious views and this Christmas show was no different IMO.
I didn’t want to believe the hate I was reading. The very same people who loved Dolly said they have now lost all respect for her. I think it’s a disgrace that we have human beings who become enraged over someone being ”inclusive“ and IMMEDIATELY turn to hate and forget those conservative, loving Christian beliefs they claim to possess. Isn’t it ironic that people who claim to be so righteous cant practice the very lessons that Christ taught us to be?
Every blessing has a curse, every curse has a blessing is what comes to my mind.
Like I decided to not watch the World Cup but then my 8 yo turned on the TV and I didn't have the heart to tell him no.
Or what if a christian doctor is pro choice but doesn't want to be the one to actually perform the abortion? If he wants to help the woman but doesn't want to take a life?
I think humanity is one big opposing/contradictory force. We have both good and evil inside of us. We even see it in many major religions/cultures: heaven & hell, ying and yang, etc. No one person is inherently good or evil. We have both inside of us. It just depends on which one we choose to nurture and act on. Hopefully this makes sense.
Good people can do bad things
Bad people can do good things
I dont know if thats taking the "easy route" i just ... when I read the post, that's the first thing i thought out loud.
This is really an interesting concept, it weirdly reminds me of my dad. He’s a great human, truly wants to do right by the world, one of my biggest supporters in everything, but somehow listened to rush Limbaugh, Fox “news” and voted for trump, not in an “I’ll listen to the other side“ or an ”ironic” way but believed it. It’s a very big brain teaser honestly.
This is a fascinating topic. I’d be interested to read some views.